Hi all,

I have a Paph stonei x praestans that had six leaf pairs, plus a new leaf about 4" long. I noticed a few days ago some yellow/brown infection on one of the leaves extending from the base of the leaf up to the middle portion. I promptly removed the leaf; the other leaves seemed OK.

Well, I just noticed today that a couple of the inner leaves had been infected as well and I ended up removing all the leaves except for the outermost leaf pair which (for the moment) appear relatively untouched. Once I'd removed all of the infected leaves, I noticed that in the middle of the tissue where all the leaves emanated was a brand-new, but very small (about 0.5 cm), leaf. So I now have a very odd-looking plant with an outer leaf pair, and a very small new leaf in the center.

The roots on this plant appear reasonably healthy. So, is it possible to continue to grow this plant? Any recommendations? Thanks for your thoughts...

If it doesn't spread and the roots are fine and healthy, I would say keep an eye on the plant and hope for the best. Can you post a photo of the plant?

Sounds like crown rot. If so, your plant has zero chance for survival, and it will infect other plants around it the same way. the plant and everything it touched must be destroyed.

It's not looking good.

Definitely isolate the plant. You may want to try some physan (or some other disinfectant spray) and cinamen.

I would also disinfect around the general area where the plant has been.

Increase airflow to the area. Have you been watering at night?

You probably have an erwinia infection which is very serious but not always fatal to the plant. First isolate the plant. Remove all of the infected tissue - don't be afraid to be ruthless. Then paint the entire area with Neem Oil. Finally dust the area with a generous amount of Neem Powder. Keep the plant relatively dry and in a well ventilated area. If caught early enough this treatment does work.

Neem Powder can be obtained from heath food stores in capsule form,
sold for human consumption.

Needless to say sterilize all tools used in treating the plant. If possible wear disposable gloves when handling the plant to prevent contaminating other plants or your growing area.

Good luck!!!

I live with the proxy, I am not running an orchid Hospital. However I have a hard time throwing out plants that have had issues. I usually give a plant with an issue the required treatment, then when I recheck the situation a few weeks later if there is no positive change, it goes in the trash bin. I have thrown out a few really nice plants, but I dont have the space to care for, or want to run the chance of spoiling my collection because of a sick plant. That is my 2 cents worth. Good Luck!

If it is really rot, then don't give up yet. Do isolate the plant like the others suggested. A few years ago while I was gone for a few days, a few of my plants got the dreaded rot. They were isolated, treated and all but one survived and bounced right back. Good luck and keep us posted!

If it is really rot, then don't give up yet. Do isolate the plant like the others suggested. A few years ago while I was gone for a few days, a few of my plants got the dreaded rot. They were isolated, treated and all but one survived and bounced right back. Good luck and keep us posted!

What did you treat your plants with?

I don't like using any kind of toxic chemical indoors and even outdoors. I use cinnamon only and it works beautifully! :lol:

I have heard of others using cinnamon, but I have never used it. I had a few aphids not long ago and I used Neem and itonly worked for about a week until the next batch hatched out. Then I used a rubbing alcohol steeped with cayenne pepper and it seemed to work.

How do you apply cinnamon?

Yep, I have also used alcohol to get rid of aphids and mealies but never tried cayenne pepper. I use water mixed with a few drops of liquid dishwashing soap detergent and alcohol to get rid of pests and works great!

I started using Protek (Potash with lots of silicates) for adjusting the pH of my fertilizer mix about 6 or so months now.

A secondary aspect of the silicates is that they strengthen cell walls and can help in disease prevention.

I've had a couple of plants (an exul in particular) that were prone to Erwinia at each new growth cycle. I would beat it out with surgery, Physan, and cinnamen. This growth round is having no problems at all with these plants.

Yes I have used cinnamon and it works great..... :-dance: I bought a few new plants once and while I had them in quaratine I noticed things I did not like. Out comes the cinnamon and dampen your plant first, sprinkle the cinnamon on and your away. Gives off a nice scent when you walk by it too.

Another thing I have done too for the case of "rot" is to remove the plant from the pot. Let the orchid sit for 2 nights on an open plate to dry and use new potting media and repot. I have saved several plants this way.

Good Luck.... :wink:

I've actually seen live Erwinia under the scope.

Super high magnification/ W/oil emersion. It's actually a bacteria (motile rods) and not a fungus. A good infection will have a distinctive odor. Kinda sweet and fermenting.

I was wondering if anyone knows about any systemic plant antibiotics??

Maybe another reason for mycorhizea??

I had an early interaction with erwinia, thank heavens I got it fast. Then, I had an even more obvious interaction. The scent is very distinctive in my opinion. Very medicinal, once you smell it it is unmistakeable! The first was not "wet and mushy", the second was very obviously.

BTW, my lowii is holding it's own. I only treated w/ cinnamon and the new growth is still growing, and rather fast! I don't know what that issue was, I guess we could call it my third possible brush, but it was dry and no scent, except, now, whenever I water I get a nice waft of cinnamon!

Also, a small aside, there was a study last year that indicated chewing cinnamon sugar free gum was good for you for the same reason. I will try and find the article, as I believe I posted it somewhere....Do be careful though, I don't use it on rotted roots, I've heard bad things about that. Just on growth's and leaves when necessary.

I also think that erwinia can be precipitated by chronic low humidity or dehydration/heat stress.

I heard about this the other day (last December) on NPR, here is the report:
http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20040522/food.asp

I did a little further research into the properties of cinnamon and found this good article:

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=68

The Watkins spice site did not have much more info, except this, which I (as a food history buff) found fascinating:

During the Bubonic Plague, sponges were soaked in Cinnamon and Cloves and placed in sick rooms because it has anti-bacterial and anti-fungal properties.

Which led me here, and while only one version of this plague deterrant contains cinnamon, I found the story amusing.

http://www.kitchendoctor.com/articles/four_thieves.html

FWIW, I use (Erwinea and other nasty bug buster) Penzey's "Extra Fancy Vietnamese Cassia" at $8.50 for 48g. I think they appreciate the extra $$$ spent. The orchids, not the plague ridden folks out there! :wink:

Does anyone know if cassia is as good as real cinnamon? or better? Perhaps I should go to a Culinary Historians of Boston meeting, for the first time since I started up w/ these babies, and ask them???? :unsure: (I'm a board member too... look what these slippers have done to me!!! I really don't know how you fish breeders do it!)

I also think that erwinia can be precipitated by chronic low humidity or dehydration/heat stress.

Hm, ya, me too. In light of recent lowii related events! Wah!!
My lowii definitely has suffered from low humidity issues, in general.

My wife is an Herbalist.

I'm thinking of trying some goldenseal. It's got great antibiotic properties.

I also think that erwinia can be precipitated by chronic low humidity or dehydration/heat stress.

Yes, I think so.

Very good for sunburn. Two weeks ago I put my catts out and my lee cooke took too much sun. Bad Burn. Out came the cinnamon and wet the spot both top and bottom. Sprinkled it in and within three days the blistyering seized and the black spot seemed to diminish. Works wonders.