Here are some photos of the new species that is to be described soon.

http://www.robzuiderwijk.nl/orchids/kyle/kyle_andreettii_1.jpg

http://www.robzuiderwijk.nl/orchids/kyle/kyle_andreettii_2.jpg

http://www.robzuiderwijk.nl/orchids/kyle/kyle_andreettii_3.jpg


This photo also features a Phrag. fischeri for comparison.
http://www.robzuiderwijk.nl/orchids/kyle/kyle_andreettii_5.jpg

How interesting!

Whoa! Look at that little sweetie! How exciting! Thanks Rob and Kyle!!

What can be used to diagnose this 'new species' from schlimii and fisheri?

best, Besk

I remember reading, not too long ago, about a newly discovered white Phrag. Is this it? Or do we have another treat in store for us?

Wow, that is very nice

My 2 cents:

My feeling is that Phrags have been overdescribed over the years, most particularly in the Lorifolia group (incl. Himantopetalum).

I have no problem with describing diversity at the species level, but to those describing this plant, please provide as complete a diagnosis as possible from schlimii and fischeri. Color variation is high in schlimii, and I think this should be taken into consideration.

That looks like a gorgeous little bloom. I'd also be interested in hearing the diagnostic characteristics. To me, it appears that the petal shape is similar to kovachii... or at least a lot more so than fischeri.

It goes without saying that botanists and horticulturalists have very different purposes for the "species" concept; the former most interested in similarities (for phylogenetic affinity), and the later most interested in differences. With orchids, I don't particularly care whether every little variation gets it's own species, as long as the use of the species concept is applied consistently and defined thoroughly, if it is going to be used in such a way.

-Matthew Gore

To my eyes the staminode shape and color are unique from schlimii and fischerii.
It does appear closely related to both, however. Perhaps one of our taxonomists would have an idea?

Interesting, and I imagine this is the "little white one" that we've been waiting to hear about.

A little disappointed...it looks like a really crappy fischeri with neat coloration. I have seen my fischeris do the same thing with their staminodes often but not the same petal stance...guess I'll have to wait to see more pics of this new plant and read the description before I decide.

Jon

Dear Beskriver,
I think that the persons who are working for the description of the new species (I think it will be in USA in cooperation with Ecuador) will make a good work.
It is really the first time that the discussion about a new species of this genus starts before the description is published.

Best greetings

Olaf

FYI.

As Kyle told us in this forum about two weeks ago, the new species is to be formaly described by Phil Cribb.

Later in a PM Kyle told me, and I quote:
"The description will likely be in a journal called lancasety. It's published by the lancasted botanical garden in Costa Rica."

RZu.

What Rob said is correct.

But my spelling was terrible. Its the Lankaster Botanical Garden. The journal is Lankasterianna, or something like it. And I´m not 100% sure thats where it is being published. The description is done and it is waiting to be printed/published.

Kyle

Is there any further news on this discovery?

No, news.

I guess we just have to wait until the description comes out. I don't have a date for that.

Kyle

Very interesting!

thanks for the photos!

very nice!!:cool:

Thanks for the great pictures!

To me one of the big differences (besides plant habit and flower color/shape) between Phrag. schlimii and Phrag. fischeri is that the flowers of Phrag. fischeri are autophilous (they selfpollinate) while in Phrag schlimii they do not. Other examples of Phragmipedium species that self-pollinate are Phrag. lindenii and Phrag. boissierianum.

Does anyone know if the flowers of this new species self-pollinate or not?

Robert

They do have a tendency to self. But I'm not 100% sure. I see that mother plants at Ecuagnera with capsules, but no label with the detail of date and sib or self. They are usually very good about recording that info. I will make some inquires and get back to you.

Kyle

I want to go on record as observing that the first-discovery-plants of a newly described species often look like you-know-what. They may not be the norm. Take paph micranthum. It was called this based on a flower with a TINY lip, obviously not the norm.

I have seen some of the first photos of kovachii and, frankly, if it weren't for the flower size, these photos showed a flower that was floppy and kinda blah in color. Now that I have seen a broader range of photos from a larger population of plants, I see what the frenzy is all about. Imagine a BIG flower with round, chubby petals in the raspberry-grape shades I love, a big, fat lip, easy care, fast growth. No wonder!

Now imagine that crossed with some of the big-flowered phrags we have today. What will the besseae crosses look like mixed with kovachii? I wonder what would happen if a white phrag with a wide stance crossed with kovachii would be like.

Anyway... back to these photos. I suspect there are prettier flowers of this "species" that we will like a lot more.

Barbara

I agree. Totally!

Now imagine that crossed with some of the big-flowered phrags we have today. What will the besseae crosses look like mixed with kovachii? I wonder what would happen if a white phrag with a wide stance crossed with kovachii would be like.

Barbara

Hey Barbara, welcome to the forum! (Sorry, I'm late to that action!)

Now imagine no money in my bank account! :lol:

To me one of the big differences (besides plant habit and flower color/shape) between Phrag. schlimii and Phrag. fischeri is that the flowers of Phrag. fischeri are autophilous (they selfpollinate) while in Phrag schlimii they do not. Other examples of Phragmipedium species that self-pollinate are Phrag. lindenii and Phrag. boissierianum.
Robert

From my experiences down here in Ecuador is that the species that do self pollenate are locally abundant...very abundant in the case of boissierianum. Phrag lindenii would probably be as abundant but it gets collected more frequently due to having nicer flowers.

I would be very curious to find out if the habitat of Phrag fisherii is loaded with plants. The self pollenation makes me think yes. But I have a feeling no.

Not many people have visited the habitat, its very difficult to get to.

Kyle

I've several Phrag reticulatum from Portilla, that self pollinates every time they flower, seeds germinates easily and seedlings grows quite well too