ok! I've finally decided that it's time to upgrade to HID. But the usual problem, which to get! SO i'll be needing help from you guys. First, I grow in an apartment. Spare room used solely for plants. East facing window. Size of room 10 x 14 feet. Size of the area i wanna illuminate 4 x 8 feet. I'll be growing mostly cattleyas and maybe multi paphs in the future. I wanna get something that would be bright enough to bloom these plants but prevent unnecessary heat. Thanks!

Here are my choices:

a 600W digital ballast light kit + 600W HPS Osram Plantastar Bulb
http://www.bustan.ca/product_detail.asp?menuID=4&SID=25&PID=1068

or a 430W HPS Light Kit w/ Son-Agro Bulb
http://www.bustan.ca/product_detail.asp?menuID=4&SID=25&PID=152

Hello,

I manage a hydroponics store and my recomendation would be to go with the 600. The 430 would illuminate about a 5' x 5' - 6' x 6' space for the type of orchids you want to grow. The 600 would give you coverage closer to the dimensions you desire. The light will probably have to be hung about 4' above the plants to get the desired coverage. I wish you the best of luck growing under HID; I grow all of my plants under lights. Happy Growing.

The 600 watt is the better of the 2, and won't make as much heat, but this is what I recommend:

http://www.plantitearth.com/store/product.asp?pid=609&catid=4

It has a enhanced spectrum bulb, like the son agro, a Lumatek ballast which is one of the best on the market, and the Hydrofarm Radiant Hood. It is alot cheaper than that other 600 watt system! that is what set up I am going to get this winter.

I have been growing and blooming my slippers successfully for many years under a 430W HPS w SonAgro on a light track and my grow space is about 6' x 8'. It does create heat but my slippers love it!

Thanks guys for all the input. One of my other concerns is that the 600 W costs double the 430 w one. I was thinking of using a light mover to illuminate the 4 x 10 feet table putting the light a little bit lower , closer to the plants. Would that work?

I have my light about 3-4' above the plants, too close and the plants will get burned.

Nick, the site you posted, they have great selection of light kits. But the thing is, I live in Toronto, Canada. I'm not sure if they ship. If they do, maybe the shipping cost would be high. What made you decide to get the Lumatek one? There are alot of different kinds. Which one do you think would be coolest-running?

I have been growing and blooming my slippers successfully for many years under a 430W HPS w SonAgro on a light track and my grow space is about 6' x 8'. It does create heat but my slippers love it!

I agree!!:iagree:

Ramon:D

I have been growing and blooming my slippers successfully for many years under a 430W HPS w SonAgro on a light track and my grow space is about 6' x 8'. It does create heat but my slippers love it!

I also agree! All the pictures you have posted of your plants in bloom has proved that your setup works.

I also agree! All the pictures you have posted of your plants in bloom has proved that your setup works.

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

Thanks guys for all the input. One of my other concerns is that the 600 W costs double the 430 w one. I was thinking of using a light mover to illuminate the 4 x 10 feet table putting the light a little bit lower , closer to the plants. Would that work?
A light mover will work but how much will it cost?
I thought the T5's saved on energy costs and ran cooler than HID or HPS?

A light mover will (in most cases) give better results than a stationary light source. Think spreading it out vs. a big glop!

T5 bulbs do run cooler but it's very dificult to make comparisons unless you compare bulb lumen output. Watts are really a measure of how much energy is being consumed, not that of light output. How many watts produces how many lumens is a reasonable comparison (when you are comparing bulbs of similar spectral output).

Ken Brewer

Nick, the site you posted, they have great selection of light kits. But the thing is, I live in Toronto, Canada. I'm not sure if they ship. If they do, maybe the shipping cost would be high. What made you decide to get the Lumatek one? There are alot of different kinds. Which one do you think would be coolest-running?

That is a digital ballast that can run both MH and HPS, so you can switch bulbs, and the digital ballasts use less energy, plus, they make the light brighter!! This one would be cooler running, is my bet.

After seeing Peters setup and plants I'm planning to upgrade my floresent light to a 430 hps Sunagro with a light mover this fall. :fcrossed:

DO NOT place your plants any closer than three feet from the light source. You will dry out all your flowers. The flowers on my plants never lasted that long because the lights would dry them out.

Paphs that would suppossed to last 2 months would dry out in a week.

This is a big lesson I learned with growing under HPS last winter.

Christian

The 430 won;t produce enough light to bloom cat's enough with a light mover and lowering the light. For a 4 x 10 area, go with a 600 and a light mover. You are also going to need a way to cool/ventilate the room.

I have a basement grow room with multi-level shelves. The top area 12' x 12', is lighted by 2 1000W (1 HPS / 1 MH) lights on a circular light mover. Even that is not overkill. The light levels around the perimeter are just right for phals and paphs.

The top area 12' x 12', is lighted by 2 1000W (1 HPS / 1 MH) lights on a circular light mover.

Nice Setup!

The 430 won;t produce enough light to bloom cat's enough with a light mover and lowering the light. For a 4 x 10 area, go with a 600 and a light mover. You are also going to need a way to cool/ventilate the room.

I have a basement grow room with multi-level shelves. The top area 12' x 12', is lighted by 2 1000W (1 HPS / 1 MH) lights on a circular light mover. Even that is not overkill. The light levels around the perimeter are just right for phals and paphs.

Interesting setup!! Are the bulbs in the same hood?

It's two separate hoods. I have some pictures posted in another forum and replied with a link to the pictures on that forum, but it looks like my reply was removed. I'll get the pictures hosted and get them posted here. In the mean time, if you are familiar with other forums you can find the pictures on page 12 of the "growing area picture" thread.

Gary

I have never tried blooming full-sized catts under my HPS 430 but I can bloom mini and compact catts without a problem at all. The light is on a light mover and kept on for about 16 hours a day. I am planning on lowering the amount of time I leave the light on though to 14 hours this winter.

I did buy a couple standard sized catts recently. We'll see what happens. If they don't bloom, no problem -- more room for paphs then.

Christian

It's two separate hoods. I have some pictures posted in another forum and replied with a link to the pictures on that forum, but it looks like my reply was removed. I'll get the pictures hosted and get them posted here. In the mean time, if you are familiar with other forums you can find the pictures on page 12 of the "growing area picture" thread.

Gary

I saw it when the link was still there. It is a pretty nice setup! :thumbsup:

I have never tried blooming full-sized catts under my HPS 430 but I can bloom mini and compact catts without a problem at all. The light is on a light mover and kept on for about 16 hours a day. I am planning on lowering the amount of time I leave the light on though to 14 hours this winter.

I did buy a couple standard sized catts recently. We'll see what happens. If they don't bloom, no problem -- more room for paphs then.

Christian

I know someone who has grown and flowered a Catt under his 430W HPS without any problem. I could try it myself and I know I will also have no problem but I would much rather save the space for my Paphs! :lol:

I know someone who has grown and flowered a Catt under his 430W HPS without any problem. I could try it myself and I know I will also have no problem but I would much rather save the space for my Paphs! :lol:
:iagree::iagree: I have a Catt in bud that is a T8 Flourescent! :lol:

The 430 won;t produce enough light to bloom cat's enough with a light mover and lowering the light. For a 4 x 10 area, go with a 600 and a light mover. You are also going to need a way to cool/ventilate the room.

I have a basement grow room with multi-level shelves. The top area 12' x 12', is lighted by 2 1000W (1 HPS / 1 MH) lights on a circular light mover. Even that is not overkill. The light levels around the perimeter are just right for phals and paphs.

Hey, Gary. What's a good way of cooling/ventilating a room? Would putting an exhaust fan by the window suffice?

Hey, Gary. What's a good way of cooling/ventilating a room? Would putting an exhaust fan by the window suffice?

How about air cooling the light?? Put a blower on one end of a hood made with the holes, and a dryer duct on the other side going out the window.

How about air cooling the light?? Put a blower on one end of a hood made with the holes, and a dryer duct on the other side going out the window.

That is what I do.

The best way to keep the room cool is to remove the excess heat before it heats the air. I have 4" exhaust ducts connected to both reflectors (pulling about 100 cfm though each) to remove heat from the reflector before it heats the room. During the winter my maximum daytime temp run 80-85 degrees with about 4000 Watts of lights (HID + fluorescents) in the room.

HID bulbs last longer when hot, while fluorescents should be kept cool. I like Hydrofarm radiant reflectors that have an outside shell and an inside reflector and have connectors for ducting. The bulb stays hot and air between the two layers removes much of the heat before it heats the room.

I have a 12’ x 20’ grow room in the basement. The room is sealed from the rest of the house with its own air supply. Primary lighting is 2 1000W (1 MH, 1 HPS) HID lights on a circular light mover. The HID lights are exhausted to the outside. This keeps my maximum daytime temperature around 80 degrees. The wheeled, two-tier benches are pushed tight together under the HID lights in the middle of the room. When I need to get at something in the middle I just roll when apart. Lighting on the lower level is provided by fluorescent lights.

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/8438/gr1adj1.th.jpg (http://img300.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gr1adj1.jpg)
http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/8440/gr2bi0.th.jpg (http://img300.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gr2bi0.jpg)
http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/5736/gr3rb5.th.jpg (http://img300.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gr3rb5.jpg)

The air is humidified using a furnace humidifier and small water fountain pump in a plastic trash can to supply water to the unit. A duct fan pulls air through the unit into the room. Humidity will run from 54% - 70%, depending on outside air conditions. I decided on this configuration because it takes less floor space than a console humidifier, doesn’t need to be refilled as often as smaller humidifiers and is less expensive than a console humidifier.
http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/5686/gr4ayz2.th.jpg (http://img300.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gr4ayz2.jpg)

I just added a Dosatron for watering. I use an inexpensive 32 gallon trash can to hold the water. A float stops the flow from an RO unit when it is full. A 12-volt 2.8 gallon/minute pump pressurizes the water. The nice thing about this pump is that is shuts off when the set pressure is reached. I mix the fertilizer concentrate in a 5 gallon bucket and the Dosatron injects it into the water flow. The plumbing is configured with a bypass so that the Dosatron can be removed (unscrew two connectors) and water can still be delivered.
http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/427/gr7sq6.th.jpg (http://img300.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gr7sq6.jpg)

Electricity for everything is connected to a sub-panel in the room. A 30-amp power relay in the box below the sub-panel is used to turn the lights on and off. I didn’t want to mess around with multiple 15 amp plug in timers. I also have a meter-grade power meter tracking my power use. This summer while everything is out in the shade house, I’m rewiring the HID lights for 220V and add a 220V circuit and another power relay to the system.
http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/427/gr7sq6.th.jpg (http://img300.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gr7sq6.jpg)

WOW - quite the setup!:thumbsup:

That is a serious set-up. Totally hard core!!! You must get some amazing results.

Christian

How much does it cost a month to run??
I also like your Hydrofarm Radiant reflectors. Those are the ones that I will get when I get my system.

How much does it cost a month to run??
I also like your Hydrofarm Radiant reflectors. Those are the ones that I will get when I get my system.

It's about $150/month for 8 months of the year. The other 4 months everything (almost) is outside.

That is a serious set-up. Totally hard core!!! You must get some amazing results.

Christian

The most noticeable improvement in growth was with the replacement of the portable humidifier with the furnace unit. I am able to keep the humidity higher (~60%) and the plants responded.

Nice setup.

Ok guys this is what I decided to get! 600 W HPS system with a digital Lumatek Ballast, a Hortilux bulb and this reflector http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/7231/reflectorcylinderia6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
connected to a duct and a fan to blow air out of the window. What do you guys think? Does anyone have any experience with this type of reflector? Thanks for all your help guys!

nice. your plants will go nuts under that lamp.

for the exhaust, get a good quality blower, like a dayton or a vortex. cheaper blowers can burn out in 1-2 years.

Nice! I like the Lumatek and the Hortilux combination.
I have no experience, but I do know that I have seen the reflectors that have the "tube". But definitly get a good blower!!! Dayton blower are very nice. They last a long time!

Nick, this kind of reflector has to have a blower or it will crack. Makes me think twice. Does the radiant need to be air-cooled? Would it still run cool by itself?

Nick, this kind of reflector has to have a blower or it will crack. Makes me think twice. Does the radiant need to be air-cooled? Would it still run cool by itself?

No it is optional, and it is also the coolest running fixture on the market according to Hydrofarm.

Awesome setup...too cool!:cool: