I have a question that hopefully someone can answer today since I'm trying to rearrange the GH!

I told one grower that I visisted that I rearranged my GH so that I didn't have any plants on the shelves below the other plants so as not to spread viruses. I also told him about the blowtorch I got to sterilize my tools.

He told me that spread of viruses was not something to worry about with paphs and phrags. Can anybody confer or contradict that?

He said the concern is more regarding light; he didn't think the paphs could get enough light on the bottom shelves. I think I can set up the lower shelves in a way that they can get sufficent light so that is not my concern.

Thanks for you input!!!

I have a question that hopefully someone can answer today since I'm trying to rearrange the GH!

I told one grower that I visisted that I rearranged my GH so that I didn't have any plants on the shelves below the other plants so as not to spread viruses. I also told him about the blowtorch I got to sterilize my tools.

He told me that spread of viruses was not something to worry about with paphs and phrags. Can anybody confer or contradict that?

He said the concern is more regarding light; he didn't think the paphs could get enough light on the bottom shelves. I think I can set up the lower shelves in a way that they can get sufficent light so that is not my concern.

Thanks for you input!!!

I am crazy paranoid about viruses.

Realistically though especially paphs but also phrags it is less of a concern. Paphs are old world orchids and tend to be more resistant to viruses than other types. There is also less need to cut paphs with tools which is prob how most viruses are spread. Regardless I try to avoid water from one plant running into another and I seperate my paphs from everything else because I am paranoid. I would never let water from nonpaphs phrags run into my paphs. Never. Hopes this helps

does anyone know how long some of the orchid viruses survive in a greenhouse without a host?

I am crazy paranoid about viruses.

Realistically though especially paphs but also phrags it is less of a concern. Paphs are old world orchids and tend to be more resistant to viruses than other types. There is also less need to cut paphs with tools which is prob how most viruses are spread. Regardless I try to avoid water from one plant running into another and I seperate my paphs from everything else because I am paranoid. I would never let water from nonpaphs phrags run into my paphs. Never. Hopes this helps

Thanks!

How about paphs to paphs? I was thinking that I could put my multis on the top and other paphs on the bottom? Does that seem safe or is that too risky too?

You've visited several commercial greenhouses now...have any of them grown paphs in rows on top of each other? No, for good reason. It's not just virus that you have to think about, but spreading bacterial rot, fungus etc. Like I said before, crown rot is much more prevalent in Fall and Winter and stacking paphs on top of each other so run-off goes into the paphs below is asking for problems. If you had a collection comprised of home depot no-names I'd probably tell you to do whatever you want,no big loss. From what I remember you've spent thousands on orchids lately and if they were mine, I'd make sure they got the best culture.

Vendors are good at telling you to buy more plants when you've got no more room. You need to resist the urge if you have no space. Or add on.

Thanks!

How about paphs to paphs? I was thinking that I could put my multis on the top and other paphs on the bottom? Does that seem safe or is that too risky too?

I think it is prob ok. I do it a little but since I am nuts I avoid old divisions or collected plants being hung above valuable plants

Thanks!

How about paphs to paphs? I was thinking that I could put my multis on the top and other paphs on the bottom? Does that seem safe or is that too risky too?

No, that is not a good idea, not only can you spread diseases but you will also be shading the plants below and without sufficient light, they will suffer. It is better to grow all your plants on one level.

also, if plants are hanging under others, if the top plants have bugs, they'll wash down to the bottom row...

Peter's right about this. And you probably won't need tools for dividing, but trimming off unsightly leaves etc. you may need them. DO STERILIZE them!

Okay....thanks everyone for your input! I think I will try to set up a little outdoor space to hold me over. Yikes...this really speeds up my need for a bigger GH!

i forgot to add this to my last post, but that's another reason to keep insects in control as bugs can spread viruses...

It seems to be regularly reported that Paphs are not prone to contracting viruses. But I read an article on the net a while back that said this was a total myth and that Paphs were just as likely to contract viruses as much as any other orchid. They did a study sampling Paph growers collections for viruses and found that a significant proportion of collections indeed had viruses. The frightening thing about Paphs was that unlike other orchid groups, Paphs show no outward symptoms of having a virus. They don't look any different. Unless you have them tested you would never know.

David

It seems to be regularly reported that Paphs are not prone to contracting viruses. But I read an article on the net a while back that said this was a total myth and that Paphs were just as likely to contract viruses as much as any other orchid. They did a study sampling Paph growers collections for viruses and found that a significant proportion of collections indeed had viruses. The frightening thing about Paphs was that unlike other orchid groups, Paphs show no outward symptoms of having a virus. They don't look any different. Unless you have them tested you would never know.

David
I don't think this is true. From what I have read and heard is that when tested they can have viruses but the prevelance is much lower than in other orchid types. How prone they are is unknown unless you conduct a study of different viruses in a controlled setting on groups of different orchids.


Again, Many people hang large multi florals and while I agree it is preferable not to have the waste run off on to other plants if it happens it is no biggy.
Pests spread whether there is dripping from other plants or not. Also if you hang plants the water usually only hits one other plant so I can tolerate 2 plants having the same ailments if they even have any

again I am talking about hanging plants above not stacking them rows on top of others. If you hang plants high enough it blocks little light because after the light passes the blocked area the light around it rediverges and fills in the spot again

again I am talking about hanging plants above not stacking them rows on top of others. If you hang plants high enough it blocks little light because after the light passes the blocked area the light around it rediverges and fills in the spot again

Yes, many growers do hang plants in their greenhouses and I have personally seen a couple of growers that do. Luther Travis an avid orchid/slipper collector with over 7000 orchids does just that and he was featured on OBSESSION WITH ORCHIDS a few years ago. Here a few screencaps from the show.

i've heard it can take up to seven years from the time of infection of a plant until it visually shows signs of the virus, if it even does...

Luther Travis looks like he has quite a beautiful collection there!!!

Luther Travis looks like he has quite a beautiful collection there!!!

Hi Ralph,

I sent you the video, have you watched it? His greenhouse is on the rooftop of an apartment building in NY, just imagine the cost of running and maintaining it in the winter! :eek:

Yes, I remembered it from the video. I think when I watched it at the time I was only interested in Paphs and Phrags....Now, that I am enjoying more and more orchids, it seems more stunning to me...LOL!

Yes, I remembered it from the video. I think when I watched it at the time I was only interested in Paphs and Phrags....Now, that I am enjoying more and more orchids, it seems more stunning to me...LOL!

Well, now you definitely need a much bigger greenhouse, don't you? :Grin:

Ralph, I have a 2 tier setup with my dendrobiums and cattleya's on the top shelves. My paphs and phrags are on the main bottom shelves and are doing very well. I also have paphs suspended with chain lower infront of the lower shelves. This week will take some pics so you can see them. When I fertilize the cats and dens, the paphs and phrags get covered with a plastic tarp. I do not want to fertilize them as much as the others, and the vandas hang high and get fertilizer twice a week.
Seems like a weird system but it works out well. Oh, the phals are on a two tiered shelf on the other side. I check my plants regularly for bugs/fungus, etc. and give them a physan drench once a month.
They all grow in harmony.:cool:

John

Ralph, Did you see my 3 tier set up?? I have 3 tiers, and none are above other plants.

I check my plants regularly for bugs/fungus, etc. and give them a physan drench once a month.
They all grow in harmony.:cool:

John

You do a physan drench once a month? Is that something I should be doing too?

Ralph, Did you see my 3 tier set up?? I have 3 tiers, and none are above other plants.

Yes, I saw your set up!!! It looks cool!!! I've thought about making benches like yours but I wasn't sure it that would allow my any additional growing area? :confused:

I've fit everything in fine now...we'll see what happens when everything start to grow more or I buy more plants!!!

BTW, I did water this morning and it was all pretty easy!!! Whewww!!!

You do a physan drench once a month? Is that something I should be doing too?
Ralph, I met Norman Fang from orchids.com and he really feels that this is good maintenance for your plants. I have been doing so religiously and have very few problems with fungus and to date no diseases. I use it with a teaspoon of wisk per gallon.:cool:

John

Ralph, I met Norman Fang from orchids.com and he really feels that this is good maintenance for your plants. I have been doing so religiously and have very few problems with fungus and to date no diseases. I use it with a teaspoon of wisk per gallon.:cool:

John

Hey, Norman Fang is in my neck of the woods. I've wanted to see if I could see his GHs. I don't know if he is open to the public. I did see some Paph Berenice on his site! I will look into adding that to my regimine!

Something I found on the internet that might be of interest.

David


Overview

Paphs initially appear to be free from parasites and deseases that usually afflict other genera of orchids, however, looks can be decieving. It is now known that at least 6% of all Paphiopedilums in cultivation are infected with CMV or OFV, with a likelihood of a much higher infection rate with unknown viruses. Studies completed by Xavier de Loubresse suggest epidemic infestation with unknown viruses and diseases living in vascular tissues, likely accounting for the regarded slow growth.

Viruses
Viruses are a horror for Paph growers, worst of all because they typically show no symptoms. It used to be said that Paphiopedilums did not get viruses, but a recent test of a paph collection came up with a 4% infection rate. Plants long in cultivation and used for the cut flower trade are most likely to be infected. For instance Paph. King Arthur from the tested collection was infected.

Known Paph Infectous Virii: Cymbidium Mosaic Virus, Tobacco Mosaic Virus.

Symptoms: Often there are no visual symptoms. Growth rate is often your best indicator.

Diagnosis: The best method for diagnosis is to examine a tissue sample under an electron microscope. However, electron microscopes are typically only available at Universities and research laboratories. Your local micropropagation lab should be able to tell you if your plant material is virus-infected. This typically requires a simple ELISA, SIN, or ENTA test.

Transmission: Frequently transmitted from plant to plant by insects. Human transmission by the use of unsterilized tools, pots, table tops, benches, hands, reused water for watering several plants, is the most frequent cause. See horticultural hygiene. Propagules are also found on seeds harvested by green pod culture

Treatment: There is no cure for virii. Plants must be burned entirely. If you have access to a premium service lab, it may be possible to clone virus-free Paphiopedilum tissues from meristem to recover costly breeding plants, however such services would be very costly.

can you please tell us the source of this info. Thanks

can you please tell us the source of this info. Thanks

Unfortunately I can't find the website I got this off. It was a few years ago so it may no longer be available. I was able to get this text from an email I sent to a Paph friend of mine. Unfortunately I did not include the link itself.

David

it is from the old nascent orchids site which is now defunct.